COMPARE Michigan MFE or Columbia MSOR ?

[Shubhani]

Hello

I graduated in Electrical Engineering in 07 and am currently working. I decided to change my field and applied for a Masters in Financial Engineering program at Columbia University and the University of Michigan at Ann Arbor. Both have accepted me - however, Columbia accepted me into their Operations Research program (They said my background was better suited for this program) I am really confused as to which program I should choose and I have multiple questions listed below -

How different are the two programs?

Which program would have better job prospects once I graduate?

Recruitment wise - Would Columbia be a better option as it is in New York? (I am guessing that many companies will have bases in New York and will probably recruit from Columbia)

Could I go into the OR program and later shift to the FE program at Columbia?

What kind of placement rates are there for both universities?

I have all these questions as at this point - I am not really sure as to what I should do. I believe that my math and programming skills are pretty strong and I would like to pursue a career where I can use these skills. Any help clearing out my doubts will really help me.

 

[alain]

Search this forum about the Columbia OR program. There are some interesting discussions. God only knows if they are true though.

 

[Andy Nguyen]

I decided to change my field and applied for a Masters in Financial Engineering program at Columbia University and the University of Michigan at Ann Arbor. Both have accepted me - however, Columbia accepted me into their Operations Research program (They said my background was better suited for this program)

Personally, I've never been a fan of Columbia's infamous "recommendation" method. The way I see it, they are effectively saying "Hi there, sorry, our FE program is full and/or you are not qualified. By the way, don't go anywhere yet. We have some other programs we think you are a perfect candidate for. Why don't you just join our MSOR program. They are OK, well, not as good as FE but still, it's Columbia"

For all I know, lots of people are very happy when they got "recommended" to the MSOR program. After all, they got in Columbia University and who cares about little details. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with being happy there.

Maybe I don't know how things work at places where you have competing programs under the same university. To deny one's admission to one dept and admit to another one is just a way of saying MSOR is second tier to FE in my opinion.
It's Columbia University after all. Shouldn't they adhere every applicant to the highest admission standard possible ?

It would be interesting to know how many people who applied to FE and got recommended to MSOR versus the number of people who applied to MSOR in the first place.
From the many posts I read, the number seems to indicate that everyone who felt to get in FE got recommended to MSOR.
It's a fine business practice but I doubt it's in the student's best interest.

i'll end my rant here. #-o

You should read more about MSOR and whether you can move to FE later on here (post #54 by Tigga). It has some interesting info regarding the placement FE vs MSOR.

As for UMich, it's in Michigan and it's very, very far from NYC. (that's much I can say about them)

You should be the one who tells us about the placement rate at UMich (call them and post here). The placement at MSOR is not pretty from all people I talked to.

 

[Yuriy]

A lot depends on your personal preferences. Compare the courses in the two programs. You might not even want to go through OR in the first place.
Obviously, placement into financial sector is better through FE. But people get jobs in finance with OR degrees, I personally know one person with a masters degree in OR who is working for American Express.

 

[Sachin]

I found some information on Michigan's placements after a bit of search:

Engineering Career Resource Center: Michigan Engineering Salaries

 

[luso]

First, UM is a great school, and it has a strong alumni support system. Some of my family members went there. The quality of education is very good there. Actually, I like their campus. Location is a problem, nowadays, not many companies are willing to pay you to come for interview.

Second, CU's MSOR is far away from its MSFE. Will you pay the same amount of money for MSFE to get a MSOR degree and use it to compete with MSFE graduates on Wall Street?

I think most hiring managers know CU's MSFE program under IEOR, but not sure how many of them will know (or willing to know) CU's MSOR porgram under IEOR.

When people compare programs, they will do things like:
School A's FE vs School B's FE
I not sure how often you will see people compare in the following ways:
School A's FE vs School B's OR
or
School B's FE vs School B's OR

For a 3 semester program, the chance for you to switch from OR to FE within same school, and very same college is low. You should choose the one you really like, and the one you think you can learn subjects that are useful to you.

 

[pardasani]

In my personal opinion you actually would want to the current batch// alumni of these programs so that you get a better idea which program is a better fit...

that's one great thing about baruch i would say -- quantnet, where prospective students can post questions and doubts !!!

 

[Andy Nguyen]

I found some information on Michigan's placements after a bit of search

The median salary is 85K but the sample size is only 5 so it's far from indicative. The data gathering method is interesting. Students submit an online survey and the school gather salary data from that survey.

 

[Yuriy]

I think most hiring managers know CU's MSFE program under IEOR, but not sure how many of them will know (or willing to know) CU's MSOR porgram under IEOR.

Usually, if an IEOR department exists, it offers a MSOR degree. I am sure that hiring managers know that MSOR program is under IEOR They also know that MSOR is not quite MSFE. But if the position only requires skills that are part of MSOR, the person can be hired.

 

[Vic_Siqiao]

Umich MFE is a very good program

 

[sundar]

Personally, I've never been a fan of Columbia's infamous "recommendation" method. The way I see it, they are effectively saying "Hi there, sorry, our FE program is full and/or you are not qualified. By the way, don't go anywhere yet. We have some other programs we think you are a perfect candidate for. Why don't you just join our MSOR program. They are OK, well, not as good as FE but still, it's Columbia"

For all I know, lots of people are very happy when they got "recommended" to the MSOR program. After all, they got in Columbia University and who cares about little details. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with being happy there.

Maybe I don't know how things work at places where you have competing programs under the same university. To deny one's admission to one dept and admit to another one is just a way of saying MSOR is second tier to FE in my opinion.
It's Columbia University after all. Shouldn't they adhere every applicant to the highest admission standard possible ?

It would be interesting to know how many people who applied to FE and got recommended to MSOR versus the number of people who applied to MSOR in the first place.
From the many posts I read, the number seems to indicate that everyone who felt to get in FE got recommended to MSOR.
It's a fine business practice but I doubt it's in the student's best interest.

i'll end my rant here. #-o

You should read more about MSOR and whether you can move to FE later on here (post #54 by Tigga). It has some interesting info regarding the placement FE vs MSOR.

As for UMich, it's in Michigan and it's very, very far from NYC. (that's much I can say about them)

You should be the one who tells us about the placement rate at UMich (call them and post here). The placement at MSOR is not pretty from all people I talked to.

I am new to this forum and the area of study and need some help. My son is an undergrad at Columbia U, wants to go into FE. I hear Columbia's MFE is highly ranked, but what is undergrad concentration like? What are job prospects? Should he continue on to MFE or PhD? By the way, Columbia seems to have an MA in Mathematical Finance that looks similar to MFE. What are the differences? Thanks.

 

[Andy Nguyen]

Tell your son to look at this thread http://www.quantnet.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1985&highlight=columbia

There is a side-by-side comparison between the courses in those two programs. As he is already at Columbia, he should talk to a undegrad counselor to see which courses he need to take to prepare.

You are a great dad. Your son should be asking this question, instead

 

[Yuriy]

I updated Columbia's side by side comparison (see Andy's link).

As an undergrad, your son should become a frequent visitor to career services (or some other name they go by) office. Have his resume ready and look for internships while still in school.

As far as MS degree, he should check FE and FM programs in NYC (Columbia, NYU, CMU, Baruch) as well as some out of state programs.

The differences between the two programs at Columbia are in electives, since most programs offer similar core courses. It is your preferred concentration that matters. Some people want to go into programming, some can't stand C++, some like PDEs, some like Fixed Income.

 

[Andy Nguyen]

Michigan MFE decisions are out this morning.
If you receive the result, please add or update your Tracker timelines