What should I aim for?

[Santiago Martinez]

Okay heres my profile:
- Mechanical engineering BSc - GPA 3.0 (in south america). Did go through the basic classes most masters recommend (Calculus I,I,III, Linear Algebra, Prob and Stats, Programing -Java and Matlab and I also taught myself Python-)
- GMAT focus - 655 93 percentile (which equates to a 710 in the GMAT)
- No relevant work experience, ive been in Accenture as a consulting analyst for 3 years since graduation

Which MathFin/MFE programs do you guys think im likely to get in to???

Im open to US or Europe.

Any inputs are much appreciated!

 

[Andy Nguyen]

Are you aiming for 2025 incoming class? If so, it will give you roughly a year to improve your profile and optimize your application.
To be frank, and with the basic info you provide, you don't have a very competitive profile for the top programs. You can get into some program but do you want to?
I think the research you need to do is identify the programs you want to get in, to get the jobs you want to do. Then you need to tailor your applications to appeal to them.
You have time and you have all the info you need here on QuantNet.

 

[ajjjw]

If you’ve been at accenture, you would be quite competitive for top 25 MBA programs. How sure are you about pursing quantitative finance? if you love it, don’t let folks on here discourage you from applying even if you may not get into a top 10 program. One life, it’s worth a shot…

 

[MikeLawrence]

if you love it, don’t let folks on here discourage you from applying even if you may not get into a top 10 program. One life, it’s worth a shot…

This is bad advice. You only really get one shot to launch yourself in this trajectory, doing it from a bad program will cripple your entire career.

If you are serious, become qualified. Prepare over 1-2 years max (you won't need more if you're serious about it) and then get into a good program so you can get a good job.

 

[ajjjw]

This is bad advice. You only really get one shot to launch yourself in this trajectory, doing it from a bad program will cripple your entire career.

If you are serious, become qualified. Prepare over 1-2 years max (you won't need more if you're serious about it) and then get into a good program so you can get a good job.

Respectful disagree, but i get your point. sure, if you go to a lower tier program you’re likely not getting a front office buyside role. However there are a lot of other roles such as back office risk, etc.

 

[quantyscientist]

Agree here. The quant industry is competitive. If you’re doing well at Accenture ace and further it with the MBA. Join a program that gives you the edge and that’s the few main schools. The first job in this industry is impt

 

[MikeLawrence]

Respectful disagree, but i get your point. sure, if you go to a lower tier program you’re likely not getting a front office buyside role. However there are a lot of other roles such as back office risk, etc.

You have edited (and considerably shortened) your first reply, but I'll respond to some of it.

In terms of lifetime earnings, getting a back office risk at a small firm right out of your masters program most often will cripple your career - if you measure by lifetime earnings. Risk jobs can be great, but only if you're learning things that can propel you into further competence and increased responsibility.
Giuseppe Paleolago seems to have had an interesting career, but he did it the right way.

Giuseppe Paleologo - New York University | LinkedIn

All links to book, book draft, lecture notes twitter etc are all… · Experience: New York University · Location: New York · 500+ connections on LinkedIn. View Giuseppe Paleologo’s profile on LinkedIn, a professional community of 1 billion members.

www.linkedin.com

Also, his thoughts on getting a job and doing it the right way: Giuseppe Paleologo on LinkedIn: Buy-Side Quant Job Advice | 11 comments

OP has a 3.0 GPA, and barely meets the pre-reqs. His current job is not quantitative, and as far as we know he has no solid mathematical maturity to suggest that if given any opportunity he can capitalize on it well enough to catch the attention of recruiters. From this profile, Santiago needs a masters degree in order to gain the skillset to get (and then keep) a QF job. If he join a poorly ranked program now he:
A: won't have been given any instruction to help him with interviews, which will start as soon as the program does
B: most likely not have the mathematical prowess to fully appreciate the material he is presented with, if it is of a high enough level
C: Probably leave the program still not knowing how to code very well.

Where C++/Python and other programming languages used in MFE programs

This article will be updated frequently. If you are a student of the programs below, please feel free to contribute to the course name, link to the course as well as the programming used. To apply to MFE programs, you have to demonstrate a programming proficiency. Some programs are very...

quantnet.com

The very top students at lesser ranked schools (though not all of them, and even then rarely on the same timeline) can build careers that rival the median student anywhere, but the median student at a lowly school will not do so. If they did, the school would not maintain a low rank. From what we know, Santiago would not be a top student. Now, you'd say that these outcomes are just fine and there's no need for all the work to get a better outcome. Once again, I disagree. For anyone able to take the time to do it right, I don't think it actually takes over two years of really dedicated work to turn yourself into a candidate who can get into a very solid program.

Now, @Santiago Martinez,
I'm of the same opinion as @quantyscientist, if you're doing well in Accenture just stay there.
Even if you get into a decently ranked program, the compensation probably won't be better than you'd be getting at Acc if you just stayed there - or got an MBA and then went back or job-hopped into a better position.

 

[Eric Kopen]

You have edited (and considerably shortened) your first reply, but I'll respond to some of it.

In terms of lifetime earnings, getting a back office risk at a small firm right out of your masters program most often will cripple your career - if you measure by lifetime earnings. Risk jobs can be great, but only if you're learning things that can propel you into further competence and increased responsibility.
Giuseppe Paleolago seems to have had an interesting career, but he did it the right way.

Giuseppe Paleologo - New York University | LinkedIn

All links to book, book draft, lecture notes twitter etc are all… · Experience: New York University · Location: New York · 500+ connections on LinkedIn. View Giuseppe Paleologo’s profile on LinkedIn, a professional community of 1 billion members.

www.linkedin.com

Also, his thoughts on getting a job and doing it the right way: Giuseppe Paleologo on LinkedIn: Buy-Side Quant Job Advice | 11 comments

OP has a 3.0 GPA, and barely meets the pre-reqs. His current job is not quantitative, and as far as we know he has no solid mathematical maturity to suggest that if given any opportunity he can capitalize on it well enough to catch the attention of recruiters. From this profile, Santiago needs a masters degree in order to gain the skillset to get (and then keep) a QF job. If he join a poorly ranked program now he:
A: won't have been given any instruction to help him with interviews, which will start as soon as the program does
B: most likely not have the mathematical prowess to fully appreciate the material he is presented with, if it is of a high enough level
C: Probably leave the program still not knowing how to code very well.

Where C++/Python and other programming languages used in MFE programs

This article will be updated frequently. If you are a student of the programs below, please feel free to contribute to the course name, link to the course as well as the programming used. To apply to MFE programs, you have to demonstrate a programming proficiency. Some programs are very...

quantnet.com

The very top students at lesser ranked schools (though not all of them, and even then rarely on the same timeline) can build careers that rival the median student anywhere, but the median student at a lowly school will not do so. If they did, the school would not maintain a low rank. From what we know, Santiago would not be a top student. Now, you'd say that these outcomes are just fine and there's no need for all the work to get a better outcome. Once again, I disagree. For anyone able to take the time to do it right, I don't think it actually takes over two years of really dedicated work to turn yourself into a candidate who can get into a very solid program.

Now, @Santiago Martinez,
I'm of the same opinion as @quantyscientist, if you're doing well in Accenture just stay there.
Even if you get into a decently ranked program, the compensation probably won't be better than you'd be getting at Acc if you just stayed there - or got an MBA and then went back or job-hopped into a better position.

I don’t really get this, cripple your career compared to what? Getting a dream job at like Jane Street or something making like $500k right out of college?

I assume the poster doesn’t like their career at Accenture which is why they are looking into a program pivoting into a different like of work, so staying put just because their lifetime earnings would be better is depressing. Sure, a quantitative back office role wouldn’t be optimal, but at least they could do something they potentially actually like to do, will still make a good salary (and great salary comparatively to the rest of the workforce), and can get into the quant finance industry.

Your career is long, and based on my experience after college, people can grow into the careers they want as long as they are hard working and good at their jobs. I’ve seen horizontal moves and uncommon career trajectories happen as much as I’ve seen traditional trajectories. Your first job is important yes, but doesn’t define your career at all.

 

[MikeLawrence]

I don’t really get this, cripple your career compared to what? Getting a dream job at like Jane Street or something making like $500k right out of college?

(practically) no one should expect 500k fresh out of college, or ever, even in quant fin. That's not what I'm saying he should shoot for -don't straw man the argument.

What you should have done was look up Accentures salary ranges and point out that even the 15th best QN ranked program puts out a median salary possibly exceeding Santiago's current salary.

if you trust this source: Accenture Consultant Salary
but if you trust this one then Santiago is going to - in the current most likely scenario - go to school for a year and a half and then enter an entry level position in a new area that does not pay as much as the job he left Accenture Management Consultant Salary | $92K-$457K+ | Levels.fyi

I assume the poster doesn’t like their career at Accenture which is why they are looking into a program pivoting into a different like of work, so staying put just because their lifetime earnings would be better is depressing. Sure, a quantitative back office role wouldn’t be optimal, but at least they could do something they potentially actually like to do, will still make a good salary (and great salary comparatively to the rest of the workforce), and can get into the quant finance industry.

First, Santiago hasn't told us why he posted the question and we aren't in a position to guess.
Honestly, the poster has a 3.0 and has taken only five math/prob courses. I don't put much stock in Santiago's heart and soul being into mathematics right now. That's barely enough mathematics to know if you actually like mathematics. Personally, I don't think it is enough. I caution against a greener-grass view of the quant field, even if the average salary of the 15th ranked QN program is actually $15-20k above Accentures median consultant analyst salary.

Your career is long, and based on my experience after college, people can grow into the careers they want as long as they are hard working and good at their jobs. I’ve seen horizontal moves and uncommon career trajectories happen as much as I’ve seen traditional trajectories. Your first job is important yes, but doesn’t define your career at all.

I wholeheartedly agree. And Santiago is already a couple years in and at a great company. This is why I advise not to rush it, to learn the basics well and give himself a proper launching pad from which to learn. Otherwise it is most likely that he will leave this company, pay ~$70k, and then leave earning exactly the same as he would have if he had stayed. I'm all for uncommon career trajectories, I think working in a job you love is worth sacrificing for and worth doing right. Especially when just a year or two of serious prep can have a large impact on the trajectory of the career you want.

 

[Andy Nguyen]

This career jumping hoping for better salary reminds me of this discussion we had recently.

Disappointed with MFE grad salaries

I knew the salary before applying to several MFE programs. But I applied nonetheless. And now that I have gotten acceptance from couple of programs, and waiting for several other programs, I deep dived into the salary structure here at qauntnet and talked with fresh mfe grads. And I am sad to...

quantnet.com

 

[Eric Kopen]

(practically) no one should expect 500k fresh out of college, or ever, even in quant fin. That's not what I'm saying he should shoot for -don't straw man the argument.

What you should have done was look up Accentures salary ranges and point out that even the 15th best QN ranked program puts out a median salary possibly exceeding Santiago's current salary.

if you trust this source: Accenture Consultant Salary
but if you trust this one then Santiago is going to - in the current most likely scenario - go to school for a year and a half and then enter an entry level position in a new area that does not pay as much as the job he left Accenture Management Consultant Salary | $92K-$457K+ | Levels.fyi

First, Santiago hasn't told us why he posted the question and we aren't in a position to guess.
Honestly, the poster has a 3.0 and has taken only five math/prob courses. I don't put much stock in Santiago's heart and soul being into mathematics right now. That's barely enough mathematics to know if you actually like mathematics. Personally, I don't think it is enough. I caution against a greener-grass view of the quant field, even if the average salary of the 15th ranked QN program is actually $15-20k above Accentures median consultant analyst salary.

I wholeheartedly agree. And Santiago is already a couple years in and at a great company. This is why I advise not to rush it, to learn the basics well and give himself a proper launching pad from which to learn. Otherwise it is most likely that he will leave this company, pay ~$70k, and then leave earning exactly the same as he would have if he had stayed. I'm all for uncommon career trajectories, I think working in a job you love is worth sacrificing for and worth doing right. Especially when just a year or two of serious prep can have a large impact on the trajectory of the career you want.

I don’t think comparing early career/entry level salaries is very relevant, that’s the point I was emphasizing with the $500k comment, I wasn’t seriously suggesting that as a path people should consider.

Again, a career is very long and most people make multitudes more later in their career than they would in the start. To be honest, I don’t think people should be concerned about if they make $50k or $80k or $120k in their first job. If you are good at your job and work hard you will make far more in the future.

The big money comes from when you stick in a career path and rise the ranks. Yes, anyone should make sure they are into quant finance and math enough to succeed in the industry as you mentioned, but once they know that then who cares if you have to take a salary haircut starting off considering even the most back office quant salary will still be decent. It’s about long term thinking.

 

[ajjjw]

One thing we all agree on is that Santiago has not provided enough information to make a truly informed suggestion on his path forward. Can you be a bit more specific about your role at accenture? why are you looking to switch careers? Is it driven by a desire for money/prestige or is it because you don’t like what you do now? Have you considered an MBA? If so, what interests you about quantitative finance rather than traditional business school route? Do you live in an area where you could attend non-degree math classes to improve your grades? Do you think a 1-2 year prep plan would feasibly fit in with your job and any other major life commitments?

I think this would allow us to pivot this thread back to concrete advice for you rather than a broader discussion about the tradeoffs of going to lower ranked programs.

 

[Santiago Martinez]

Hey guys! Thanks a lot for responding
Heres a bit more context:
1. Im a management consulting analyst for the strategy and consulting division of Accenture Colombia. This said, my salary is significantly lower than that of an analyst in the US.
2. My motivation to switch career paths is not mainly incentivized by compensation (tho still appealing). I really think I would enjoy a quant finance role, ive always been quite technical and enjoy data analysis and applied mathematics.
3. Im quite bored at Accenture. I feel like it promotes growth in skills like leadership, communications and project management, but theres not many technical aspects to my role nor any future roles in the company (even though theyve noticed my skills and im usually in the more analytical and technical projects, for which im very greatful).
4. Im eager to learn. I really want to develop new and relevant hard skills that allow me to become a solid candidate for quantitative jobs. This said, I would hate to pursue an MBA.
5. Im aiming to leave the country. Sadly in Colombia technical work is quite undervalued. Developers and Data scientists earn significantly lower salaries (even at the most prestigious firms) than most other roles. Hence if I want to pursue a technical career im certain it must be overseas.

I also have a question!
When you guys mention “strengthen my profile for 1-2 years”. How would I do that?
Get a stronger GMAT?
Get some relevant work experience?
Enroll in maths and programming courses?

Thanks for the thoughts guys! Its really helpful.

 

[MikeLawrence]

1. Im a management consulting analyst for the strategy and consulting division of Accenture Colombia. This said, my salary is significantly lower than that of an analyst in the US.

Well, you are in Colombia so that's to be expected. Would visa be an issue in the US or UK? That throws a wrench in things, it isn't always smooth.

2. My motivation to switch career paths is not mainly incentivized by compensation (tho still appealing). I really think I would enjoy a quant finance role, ive always been quite technical and enjoy data analysis and applied mathematics.

Cool, what skills have you picked up besides the calc and linear algebra topics. What grades did you get in these courses? How good is your experience in Java and Python?

3. Im quite bored at Accenture. I feel like it promotes growth in skills like leadership, communications and project management, but theres not many technical aspects to my role nor any future roles in the company (even though theyve noticed my skills and im usually in the more analytical and technical projects, for which im very greatful).
4. Im eager to learn. I really want to develop new and relevant hard skills that allow me to become a solid candidate for quantitative jobs. This said, I would hate to pursue an MBA.

I understand this, and would second the sentiment regarding an MBA. Are you able and willing to pay US masters tuition?

5. Im aiming to leave the country. Sadly in Colombia technical work is quite undervalued. Developers and Data scientists earn significantly lower salaries (even at the most prestigious firms) than most other roles. Hence if I want to pursue a technical career im certain it must be overseas.

See the first line of my response.

When you guys mention "strengthen my profile for 1-2 years". How would I do that?
Enroll in maths and programming courses?

Yes, I mean do this. The C++ course here (C++ Programming for Financial Engineering) will do wonders for your coding abilities.
Otherwise, I'd bulk up a bit on maths as well if you have the time and leisure to do so.
There was a study discord, but I only ever got one person to actually study anything (we were all kinda in weird spots, and the semester usually slowed everything down). @Quasar Chunawala, @Lukee, has it picked up any recently? Are groups forming? If it's worth anything, I think they're a bit more active than I have been and can let you know. Otherwise, if you're serious about it I can try and make time if you have any specific questions. I should have more when the summer starts.

However, if you start the C++ course you'll need to just burry your head and do it solo, that's the only way (ethically and in terms of what you'll get out of it) to move forward.

The GMAT is worthless, from every source I've encountered.

If you could actually get relevant work experience that would be great, but you'd still need to skill up a good amount if you want a legit shot at a good job. The job market is not easy.

Thanks for the thoughts guys! Its really helpful.

Hope anything I've said helps.

 

[Santiago Martinez]

Well, you are in Colombia so that's to be expected. Would visa be an issue in the US or UK? That throws a wrench in things, it isn't always smooth.

Cool, what skills have you picked up besides the calc and linear algebra topics. What grades did you get in these courses? How good is your experience in Java and Python?

I understand this, and would second the sentiment regarding an MBA. Are you able and willing to pay US masters tuition?

See the first line of my response.

Yes, I mean do this. The C++ course here (C++ Programming for Financial Engineering) will do wonders for your coding abilities.
Otherwise, I'd bulk up a bit on maths as well if you have the time and leisure to do so.
There was a study discord, but I only ever got one person to actually study anything (we were all kinda in weird spots, and the semester usually slowed everything down). @Quasar Chunawala, @Lukee, has it picked up any recently? Are groups forming? If it's worth anything, I think they're a bit more active than I have been and can let you know. Otherwise, if you're serious about it I can try and make time if you have any specific questions. I should have more when the summer starts.

However, if you start the C++ course you'll need to just burry your head and do it solo, that's the only way (ethically and in terms of what you'll get out of it) to move forward.

The GMAT is worthless, from every source I've encountered.

If you could actually get relevant work experience that would be great, but you'd still need to skill up a good amount if you want a legit shot at a good job. The job market is not easy.

Hope anything I've said helps.

Do you think enough upskilling could make up for my low GPA? Also what courses would you recommend to bulk up on maths?

Work visa is definetly an issue.

I also want you guys to understand that my salary expectations are probably way lower than you expect. Getting an 80k-100k salary post graduation would be a total win for me. Having this in mind, cant I aim for a top 25-50 program?
Aim high for: UCLA, Georgia Tech, Toronto, Chicago
Aim safer for: UCSD, Illinois, BU, Washington

Since im applying for September 2025 I have some time to upskill (maybe not enough to get relevant work experience tho). Could this be enough to get into some of the programs I just mentioned? And if I do, do you think plausible to get an 80-100k salary after graduation?

 

[Andy Nguyen]

There is a chance that you many not getting a job after spending a large amount on tuition/expense and lost income.
There is no program that will give you a guaranteed job on a silver plate. You still need to apply and pass several interview rounds to get an internship and job offer. The better programs with proven career services will make your process easier. You may have to send out 20 resumes instead of 200 resumes at other worse programs. The competition for this field is really fierce. You will not only compete with other quant graduates but also from STEM graduates from all the universities in the US.
You won't know for sure until you apply and the cost of application is minimal in consideration to other things.

 

[Connor]

Any opportunities at Accenture for a more quantitative role? Would Accenture pay for you to upskill?

This delays your potential entrance into QF but would strengthen your profile.

 

[Santiago Martinez]

Any opportunities at Accenture for a more quantitative role? Would Accenture pay for you to upskill?

This delays your potential entrance into QF but would strengthen your

Yeah for sure. A move to the applied intelligence team is always an option (they do mostly data analytics and data science). However, being completely honest… idk how good the Bogota team is, and I feel like what I might be able to learn is basic and mostly irrelevant for a quant career. Also it would come with a pay downgrade so… not the optimal route if u ask me.
Maybe it would look good enough on paper? Work on programming and math skills on the side… while getting “relevant work experience”

 

[Connor]

It's a matter of your interests and appetite for risk. In general, having a more quantitative job will make it easier to get future quantitative jobs (if that's what you're interested in). Either way though you won't have relevant work experience for a QF job. And I'd think taking a pay cut would be less risky than packing up and moving to the US to start a master's program.

 

[MikeLawrence]

I'd keep your pay with the management position and look to acquire skills in your current country. There is lots of information online. If you ever have enough skills that a degree in the US could pay off, then you could try and make the jump - or you could argue for a comparable salary in this other group. 'Good enough on paper' won't do you much good if you can't back it up, and you don't appear to consider the group good enough to warrant the pay cut so I doubt a future employer will either.