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What's the Future of Programming Languages in AI and Quantitative Finance?

ABGlobal

ABGlobal

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5/8/24
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Hey everyone, who here is involved in the Quant, Finance, and FinTech spaces?

I've been considering the role of different programming languages within AI and Quant Finance. It's clear that Python dominates in AI due to its versatility, while C++ is favored for its performance. However, with many startups now turning to Rust as a way to avoid licensing issues and to leverage open-source advantages, do you think C++ is becoming less attractive in quant finance because of its licensing limitations compared to Rust?

Also, are new proprietary trading firms, hedge funds, and FinTech startups starting to prefer Rust or other languages over C++ for their new projects?
 
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What do you think yourself?

Do you have hard evidence on Rust? Or from hearsay?
 
There's always going to be some use of C++, even if in some particular cases it's irrational. legacy code always exists.
 
This might be off-topic, but in crypto, it's a different story. Essentially, Rust is what all serious projects use. Zero crypto projects are being implemented in C++. Try to find *any* C++ projects that aren't a fork of Bitcoin Core or something similar. Any project that was started after 2018 likely uses Rust.
 
ABGlobal said:
White House Warns Against Using Memory-Unsafe Languages And Press Release: Future Software Should Be Memory Safe | ONCD | The White House
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ABGlobal said:
This might be off-topic, but in crypto, it's a different story. Essentially, Rust is what all serious projects use. Zero crypto projects are being implemented in C++. Try to find *any* C++ projects that aren't a fork of Bitcoin Core or something similar. Any project that was started after 2018 likely uses Rust.
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Can you back up your claims? Not everyone is doing crypto.

BTW I am working on a report/critique

"If Rust is the answer, then what is the question?" (w/o handwaving or waffle).


Rust is way down the list here #18.

TIOBE Index - TIOBE

www.tiobe.com www.tiobe.com
 
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I am a veteran in this industry and I know that computer scientists love new technologies. Many (technolgies) turn out to be fads. (caveat: I am not CS).
In 1991 there were at least 10 object-oriented languages.

All the functionality in Rust is in C++20 (and more).

Rust and OOP is not there, believe me. It is useful for sending data down channels. This is my impression, it might change :)
If anything, Rust is a protean Actor language. see
https://www.reddit.com/r/rust/comments/n2cmvd/there_are_a_lot_of_actor_framework_projects_on

// try avoiding language wars

 
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Daniel Duffy said:
Can you back up your claims? Not everyone is doing crypto.

BTW I am working on a report/critique

"If Rust is the answer, then what is the question?" (w/o handwaving or waffle).


Rust is way down the list here #18.

TIOBE Index - TIOBE

www.tiobe.com www.tiobe.com
Click to expand...
TIOBE is a bad metric. it includes the huge amount of code that's just involved in maintenance of legacy systems. it's more interesting to compare *growth* https://survey.stackoverflow.co/2023/
 
C# is TIOBE language of the year 2023.

It is used, people don't shout about it. Very good language.
 
ABGlobal said:
This might be off-topic, but in crypto, it's a different story. Essentially, Rust is what all serious projects use. Zero crypto projects are being implemented in C++. Try to find *any* C++ projects that aren't a fork of Bitcoin Core or something similar. Any project that was started after 2018 likely uses Rust.
Click to expand...
This is a symptom of a larger immaturity in the crypto space. Crypto is replete with recent students who chase after buzzwords and new fads but can't see the forest from the trees. They don't understand the pitfalls of experimenting with a new technology vs. a tried and proven workhorse.

All reputable crypto firms that a I'm familiar with are using C++ for their trading systems and Python for research. No Rust, and not Java as many banks mistakenly chose when Java has its moment.
 
CharlieJ said:
This is a symptom of a larger immaturity in the crypto space. Crypto is replete with recent students who chase after buzzwords and new fads but can't see the forest from the trees. They don't understand the pitfalls of experimenting with a new technology vs. a tried and proven workhorse.

All reputable crypto firms that a I'm familiar with are using C++ for their trading systems and Python for research. No Rust, and not Java as many banks mistakenly chose when Java has its moment.
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C++ still dominating in the hedge fund world
 
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As I continue my research, it appears that the finance industry remains heavily oriented towards C++. There doesn't seem to be any particularly pressing reason to move away from it in the near future.
 
C++ is widely used across various industries, while Rust is mostly found in blockchain companies.

Here is an interesting twist that I've noticed. Learning Rust can be a great way to get to know modern C++. Many of the concepts in modern C++ actually come from Rust. Rust offers better tutorials that help you understand these concepts, which are optional in C++. Even though it might seem easier to learn C++, tackling Rust can really boost your skills as a C++ developer.
 
ABGlobal said:
C++ is widely used across various industries, while Rust is mostly found in blockchain companies.

Here is an interesting twist that I've noticed. Learning Rust can be a great way to get to know modern C++. Many of the concepts in modern C++ actually come from Rust. Rust offers better tutorials that help you understand these concepts, which are optional in C++. Even though it might seem easier to learn C++, tackling Rust can really boost your skills as a C++ developer.
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Nope. Correlation is not causation!
I spent the last 2 weeks experimenting with Rust code and benchmarking with C++ (BTW I was the 1st C++ programmer in the Netherlands in 1990 and I originated the QN C++ courses).
summary: Rust is rather incomplete compared to C++, a kind of carbon copy of C++. I wonder how much resources are being plugged into this language.
The best way to learn modern C++ is to learn modern C++.

My report will be due in a few weeks.

I think Rust will be a side-kick for C++, interop maybe..

// type traits are used a lot in Rust
in C++11 (since 2011?). Rust's 1st release was May 2015..

Standard library header <type_traits> (C++11) - cppreference.com

en.cppreference.com en.cppreference.com
 
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