2011-2012 Quantnet Ranking of Financial Engineering (MFE) Programs

[Yike Lu]

The point is we have no idea where that number came from. I wouldn't go so far as to accuse Berkeley of cooking up the number, but it would be useful to understand where they got the number. It's not inconceivable that they poll their alumni after a year and ask them about their bonuses.

 

[MRoss]

Why are we arguing about a few thousand dollars when we are happy with our education? I am very happy for the Berkley students as well (for an excellent education as well as nifty starting salaries). So... We are happy. They are happy. Why are we arguing?

 

[abhishekkkk]

http://mfe.baruch.cuny.edu/employment-stats/

From Baruch's website -

" The annual performance-based bonus is not included here. The annual bonus is typically an additional 15-25% of the base salary, and may by prorated. We do not track these numbers. In other words, the first year total compensation of our graduates is higher than the guaranteed compensation reported."

How is this any different from what the other school (Berkeley) has done - It specifies that the bonus as unguaranteed, it separately lists the guaranteed bonuses, signing bonuses +relocation, base salary.

Baruch is listing the first year bonus as a percentage, Berkeley is listing it as an actual figure.

 

[efajardo]

Sigh...
the whole baruch vs berkeley is getting old and boring

 

[Andy Nguyen]

About.com has a guide on the 2011 Quantnet MFE Ranking
http://financecareers.about.com/od/mba/a/Financial-Engineering.htm

 

[Andy Nguyen]

A few press releases from various MFE programs upon publication of Quantnet MFE ranking.

CMU MSCF http://tepper.cmu.edu/news-multimedia/news/news-detail/index.aspx?nid=507
Princeton MFin http://orfe.princeton.edu/news/princeton-master-finance-program-tops-quantnet-ranking
Rutgers MSMF http://www.finmath.rutgers.edu/index.php?d=news&p=news_view&id=7
Baruch MFE http://www.baruch.cuny.edu/news/mfe_ranking_11.htm
Kent State http://cphp.kent.edu/news/newsdetail.cfm?customel_dataPageID_9299=2264348

 

[RAWMUSCLE]

Here's my speculation on the rankings. I struggle to see how the top programs on the list would score significantly differently from each other. In terms of the criteria of Starting Salary, Employment rates, GRE scores, and GPA, I suspect that the top programs would score very similarly. Combined, this amounts to 60% of the total. I would suspect similar scores among the top 1-6 or so. The scores are probably quite homogeneous at the top. Thus, getting into ANY one of the top programs would be great and produce similar results.

The employer survey score seems a bit iffy to judge based solely on the info given in the methodology. Sure, it said a wide range of groups around the world were surveyed, but only 39% of those surveyed responded. How many is that? Were they as diverse as the total surveyed? I see a large potential for biases here. Nevertheless, I am pretty sure that most recruiters would mention the top uni's on this list pretty consistently, so it probably differs by very little among the top.

What should make the difference for the chart-toppers should be the remaining 15%, acceptance rate, S/A ratio, and whether or not the uni replied to the survey (a 5% penalty if you will; either +5% if you replied or +0% if you didn't.)

Now with that out of the way, I can get back to the main topic of this discussion: Berkeley vs Baruch! Berkeley's acceptance rate is pretty high (17%) due to the large class sizes and small no. of applicants, so it wouldn't get that great of a score compared to Baruch's acceptance rate (6%). But I actually see that as a positive -- with a 60+ class size, Berkeley still manages to place all of their students even though job slots are limited. On top of that, I heard that Berkeley didn't reply to the survey. I speculate that if Berkeley did reply, they would jump up 1,2 or maybe even 3 spots.

Of course, it doesn't really matter... Getting into the top programs would only grant you easier access to recruiters and interviewers. In the end, it's up to how good you do in the interviews and how well you know your stuff.

Disclaimer: I chose UCB. Everyone knows west coast is the best coast.

 

[Freakonometrics]

If you'd ask me, this would be the best way to assign a rating to selectivity:

( 1 ) Assign a positive rating to # of applicants
( 2 ) Assign a positive rating to the inverse of the acceptance rate (so lower% acceptance -> higher score)

This way you have the best of both worlds.

 

[captn]

Rankings are at some times arbitrary.

This is not: http://iafe.org/html/PressRelease2.3.12.htm

UCB took first place in the International Financial Engineer Association competition. There is a rank that actually matters.

When these students give their presentation to the IAFE attendees - do you think they will go home jobless? I don't think so.

 

[DMD]

I think it would be helpful if you added an overall score for each program so we can see how big a difference there is between 1st and 5rd or 3rd and 9th. I am guessing that the programs at the top are bunched together quite closely and then there is a steep drop-off in program quality, reputation, and recruitment statistics as you move into the 10s. I think it would make the rankings more helpful for people who may be trying to weigh the program rankings with personal factors, such as location, timeline, etc.

 

[alain]

Rankings are at some times arbitrary.

This is not: http://iafe.org/html/PressRelease2.3.12.htm

UCB took first place in the International Financial Engineer Association competition. There is a rank that actually matters.

When these students give their presentation to the IAFE attendees - do you think they will go home jobless? I don't think so.

Interesting, check this link too:

https://www.quantnet.com/forum/thre...nal-trading-competition-2012.8760/#post-82723

Baruch teams took 1st and 4th places.

 

[CharlesT]

The ranking has been released

Hi Andy,

Can you please list the rankings of the specific catergories below separately? I believe it can help students better choose the programs they like. Do you think so?

You are doing a transparency project on MFE programs. Why not first doing a transparency project on this ranking??


Employer Survey Score (25%)Placement Success (50%)
Starting Salary (20%) Employment Rate at Graduation (10%) Employment Rate Three Months after Graduation (15%) Students/Administrator Ratio (5%)
Student selectivity (25%)
GRE Scores (10%)
Undergraduate GPA (5%)
Acceptance Rate (10%)

 

[darth]

Hi Andy,

Can you please list the rankings of the specific catergories below separately? I believe it can help students better choose the programs they like. Do you think so?

You are doing a transparency project on MFE programs. Why not first doing a transparency project on this ranking??


Employer Survey Score (25%)Placement Success (50%)
Starting Salary (20%) Employment Rate at Graduation (10%) Employment Rate Three Months after Graduation (15%) Students/Administrator Ratio (5%)
Student selectivity (25%)
GRE Scores (10%)
Undergraduate GPA (5%)
Acceptance Rate (10%)

I think the ranking is transparent, QN has mentioned the criteria and weightage attached to each..

 

[ferdowsi]

I think the ranking is transparent, QN has mentioned the criteria and weightage attached to each..

To be fair to CharlesT, there is a lot more info we could use: the point system to see how much difference there is between each rank, and rankings/points per category. However, this has been mentioned before and Andy has already said that he promised confidentiality in order to get the data, so he won't be releasing any more details.

 

[CharlesT]

To be fair to CharlesT, there is a lot more info we could use: the point system to see how much difference there is between each rank, and rankings/points per category. However, this has been mentioned before and Andy has already said that he promised confidentiality in order to get the data, so he won't be releasing any more details.

Thanks for your information. If he believe it is "confidential," I will 80% don't trust the final result. Because I know little about Andy, and he only gave me a final answer to a questions, but for some reason doesn't want to provide data describing how he get there.

 

[CharlesT]

I think the ranking is transparent, QN has mentioned the criteria and weightage attached to each..

It's like I told you I calculate Z using Z=X+Y. Also I told you what Z is. But now you ask me what X is because you want to compare different aspect separately. Then I said it is confidential.

 

[darth]

It's like I told you I calculate Z using Z=X+Y. Also I told you what Z is. But now you ask me what X is because you want to compare different aspect separately. Then I said it is confidential.

Ok... agreed with that

 

[Oxer]

if columbia, nyu and baruch are in new york, ny. why is nyu poly in brooklyn, ny? isnt brooklyn a part of new york city?

 

[Mike_B]

Andy Nguyen - should we be expecting a new ranking soon?

 

[Andy Nguyen]

Andy Nguyen - should we be expecting a new ranking soon?

Once every two years is the current plan.